I told my brother I would ask a question: he has a Damascus steel shotgun and is wanting to know if there is any safe way to fire it or get possibly black powder ammunition for it. I am not up to date on shotguns so I am at a loss to answer it for him. Any help would be appreciated.
Thank you
Tim
Damascus?
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Spencerphotography
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Black would be the only safe way to fire it, but I still would not. In making Damascus steel barrels, strips of metal were heated red and 'welded' around a mandrel. Which was strong enough for the mild loads at the time. The negative effect concerns the action of rust along the weld lines.
Black powder is very hygroscopic and the moisture it attracts will create rust - often along the lines mentioned above. So, when a load that is too powerful for the barrel's strength is fired, the barrel will separate at the weakest point, of course - the weakened point of the rusted weld.
Not every Damascus barrel would fail - some were cared for impeccably. But it's not easy to tell which ones they were. If the person who shot them with black did not take a lot of trouble to carefully clean after each firing session, there will be rust damage to the seams - to one extent or another.
I would say take the safe course and make a wall-hanger of it. SW
Black powder is very hygroscopic and the moisture it attracts will create rust - often along the lines mentioned above. So, when a load that is too powerful for the barrel's strength is fired, the barrel will separate at the weakest point, of course - the weakened point of the rusted weld.
Not every Damascus barrel would fail - some were cared for impeccably. But it's not easy to tell which ones they were. If the person who shot them with black did not take a lot of trouble to carefully clean after each firing session, there will be rust damage to the seams - to one extent or another.
I would say take the safe course and make a wall-hanger of it. SW
I am really not an expert - distinguished or otherwise!!
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Regnier (gunrunner)
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Spencerphotography;
True Damascus barrels are made up of three twisted rods of steel and iron. (2 steel - 1 iron) that are twisted together to form a 3 blade Damascus barrel, then twisted arond the mandrel. (this is why there is a pattern to the metal) There are some barrels that have 4 blade, 5 blade and as many as 6 blades in the mix. There was only one company in the U.S. that made a true Damascus barrel, and that was Ithaca gun Company. The problem lies in that the two differing metals do not combine properly and "air gaps" can form when the barrel is formed. Also, the carbon in the iron metal can cause weak spots.
Steve is right..... hang it on the wall and admire it for what it is. A piece of history that has earned the right to retire from work.
I hope this helps.
True Damascus barrels are made up of three twisted rods of steel and iron. (2 steel - 1 iron) that are twisted together to form a 3 blade Damascus barrel, then twisted arond the mandrel. (this is why there is a pattern to the metal) There are some barrels that have 4 blade, 5 blade and as many as 6 blades in the mix. There was only one company in the U.S. that made a true Damascus barrel, and that was Ithaca gun Company. The problem lies in that the two differing metals do not combine properly and "air gaps" can form when the barrel is formed. Also, the carbon in the iron metal can cause weak spots.
Steve is right..... hang it on the wall and admire it for what it is. A piece of history that has earned the right to retire from work.
I hope this helps.
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Regnier (gunrunner)
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Shotley;
Good question!!! The best (strongest) barrels were made in England, most of the other barrels were made in Belgum. Belgum made the barrels with the best and most different patterns. But, I do not know where Marlin obtained the Damascus barrels for the "D" grade shotguns. From 1899 to 1904, Marlin did advertise that you could have a "Twist" barrel, a 3 blade or the best 4 blade Damascus barrels for their guns. After 1905, only the 4 blade Damascus barrel was offered. I have a "C" grade 1898 that has a "Twist" barrel. A "Twist" barrel is similar to the Damascus barrel, except only one metal rod is twisted, then hammered flat then wrapped around the mandrel. Looks like a simpler version of a Damascus barrel.
Sorry, I just do not know where Marlin got the Damascus barrels. I would like to though............
Good question!!! The best (strongest) barrels were made in England, most of the other barrels were made in Belgum. Belgum made the barrels with the best and most different patterns. But, I do not know where Marlin obtained the Damascus barrels for the "D" grade shotguns. From 1899 to 1904, Marlin did advertise that you could have a "Twist" barrel, a 3 blade or the best 4 blade Damascus barrels for their guns. After 1905, only the 4 blade Damascus barrel was offered. I have a "C" grade 1898 that has a "Twist" barrel. A "Twist" barrel is similar to the Damascus barrel, except only one metal rod is twisted, then hammered flat then wrapped around the mandrel. Looks like a simpler version of a Damascus barrel.
Sorry, I just do not know where Marlin got the Damascus barrels. I would like to though............
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Jim Susemihl
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Spencerphotograhy, What company built the gun and what type of gun is it? You did not say if it was a Marlin or maybe a double gun. There were numerous double guns built that were nitro proofed and safe for shooting with nitro pressures. The gun's history would be of utmost importance. I have a couple of damascus doubles that I intend to shoot and have shot a nice little Belgian .410 double with damascus barrels. I you study the available information and your gun is in good condition it can still be safely shot if everything is as it should be. A good source for information on this is the Double Gun and Single Shot Journal. Sherman Bell wrote a series of articles titled "Finding Out For Myself". He has tested time accepted truths in a scientific manner and surprisingly disproved several. He Shot a damacus barreled Parker to destruction and recorded pressure readings. It was an average condition gun with some light pitting. The first barrel failed at something over 34,000 PSI. In a later article he diud the same test with a Parker with fluid steel barrels. They failed at within 1000 PSI of the damacus barrels. The interesting thing was that the damacus failed in a very contolled manner and the gun still locked up and was tight. The fluid steel barrel gun severly damaged the lock up and even broke the stock. If one wishes to shoot a damacus barrel gun he must understand that he is doing it at his own risk but there are more people doing it than you may think.